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In this launch episode for Season 4, Dr. Ca Trice Glenn and Dr. Dawnn Brumfield explore the intricate dynamics of church family systems drama. They delve into the concept of the ‘church within the church,’ examining how family roles and conflict manifest within congregational settings. Discover how understanding these dynamics can lead to healing and conflict resolution. Tune in to gain practical advice for church leaders and members alike.

The TheoTherapist Podcast, where we explore the intersections connecting theology and mental health. The TheoTherapist podcast is hosted by Dr. Ca Trice Glenn, a practical theologian and licensed therapist.

Episode Timeline

01:32 Introduction to Family Systems in the Church

04:00 Understanding the Intersection of Faith and Mental Health

06:32 Exploring Family Dynamics and Church Roles

09:19 Identifying Scapegoats and Heroes in Congregations

12:07 Impact of Family Systems on Church Dynamics

14:49 Curiosity and Conflict Resolution in Church Settings

17:47 Recognizing Patterns of Dysfunction in Faith Communities

22:39 The Challenge of Curiosity and Awareness

26:07 Navigating Family Systems and Community Dynamics

28:59 Grounding Practices in Community Care

32:46 Healing Through Conflict and Community Care

38:23 Grace and Intentionality in Relationships

Takeaways

  • The conversation explores the intersection of family systems and church dynamics.
  • Conflict in church settings often mirrors family dynamics.
  • Understanding personal experiences can enhance ministry effectiveness.
  • Identifying roles like scapegoat and hero helps in navigating church conflicts.
  • Healing from church hurt requires community support and compassion.
  • Truth-telling with compassion is essential for healing.
  • Creating a new narrative can help in resolving conflicts.
  • Community care is vital for maintaining healthy church dynamics.
  • Differentiation in roles can prevent chaos in congregational settings.
  • Intentionality in leadership can foster a healthier church environment.

Podcast Host

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Rev. Dr. Ca Trice Glenn, LPC, ACS

Host

Through counseling, consulting and training, Dr. Glenn shares her passion for wellness and balance. Over the last 20 years, she has held leadership positions in the entertainment, corporate, information technology and counseling fields. In addition to her professional experience, she also lives out her life’s vocational calling as an ordained minister. Dr. Glenn uses her gifts to educate and care for others seeking holistic wellness. Through counseling, consulting and training, Dr. Glenn shares her passion for wellness and balance.

Guest

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Rev. Dr. Dawnn Brumfield

Guest

Rev. Dr. Dawnn M. Pirani Brumfield is a clinical psychotherapist, ordained pastor, and mental health advocate whose life and work sit at the intersection of faith, healing, and justice. A highly respected leader in both sacred and secular spaces, she brings over two decades of experience supporting individuals and communities navigating trauma, identity, and mental wellness. As a Black queer woman in an interracial, same-gender marriage who lives with a diagnosed mental illness, Dr. Brumfield doesn't just speak about the issues - she embodies them. Her lived experience deeply informs her work, allowing her to create space for others whose stories are too often ignored, erased, or misunderstood. She is the Director of the Cultural Faith-Based Empowerment Program at Envision Unlimited, where she trains clergy, peer mentors, and community leaders to integrate mental health support into their daily practice. She also serves as Interim Pastor of United Church of Hyde Park in Chicago, a congregation committed to equity, hospitality, and healing justice. Dr. Brumfield is a storyteller at heart, known for weaving narrative, scholarship, and spiritual depth into every conversation. Whether in classrooms, pulpits, or community forums, she creates space for Black LGBTQ+ folks, helping professionals, and faith-rooted change agents to explore their full humanity - without shame or pretense. With graduate degrees in counseling, theology, family systems and pastoral care, she has become a trusted voice in conversations around culturally grounded mental health, sacred rest, and resistance to burnout. When Dawnn speaks, people listen. Her genuine passion shines through as she travels across the country, helping individuals and communities discover their own power to change and grow.

“Active members often mirror family roles within the church setting.” – Dr. Dawnn Pirani Brumfield

“Family systems theory can explain many church conflicts.” – Dr. Ca Trice Glenn

“Church groups can function like family systems, leading to drama.” – Dr. Dawnn M. Pirani Brumfield

“Different family roles, like heroes and scapegoats, influence church dynamics.” – Dr. Ca Trice Glenn